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USS Montana BB-67 2013 Modernization (under construction)
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Author:  DJBattlestations [ May 23rd, 2013, 10:17 am ]
Post subject:  USS Montana BB-67 2013 Modernization (under construction)
This is my 1st newbie attempt. In this case, I've taken an already drawn image and modified it. This is a learning process for me on how things work in Adobe Fireworks. I do know, early in the process, I was doing many of the things wrong as far as grouping and cutting out around images, which forced me to do unnecessary background reconstructions. There are probably stray pixels in this though I tried to get rid of or paint over, all I saw. I really had no earthly idea what I was doing some of the time. I have the weapons pretty much done My weakest part at this time are the electronics. I have "modernized some pieces but am not really sure what outdated pieces need to be removed and what from the parts sheets, I need to add and where. But that is why I'm here, so the experts can scrutinize the idea, point out errors, call me crazy, tell me what SB rules I'm breaking, and/or make suggestions (especially on the electronics). I hope I'm giving proper credit. This is a personal project of mine and don't care whether I am ever credited for my part of it.

Basically, I have made the following modifications to depict this layout. Everything else is to be determined.
6 – Mk41 30mm Bushmasters (2 in old 40mm quad positions before 16” Turret 1, and on main deck, either side of Turrets 2 and 3)
10 – 155mm/62 AGS-L (in former 5” twin positions).
4 – 57mm/70 (2 on each side on inside 2nd level. just aft of bridge at former 40mm quad mount, and below aft gun director).
4 – Mk49 21-cell Ram (1 each side in tubs behind and below bridge, 1 each side just behind stack, 1 each side in tubs beside tower behind stack 2).
4 - Phalanx Block 1B (1 each side behind bridge, 1 each side beside stack 2).
8 – Harpoon quad canisters (4 each side of stack 2).
256 to 384 ??? – Mk41 VLS between the stacks on new built up platform (bottom of VLS cells on main deck).
New platform between the stacks for VLS.
Elevator to below deck hanger facilities for 4 SH-60 SeaHawks aft of turret 4. (not visible in this view)
Several mack/mast changes.
Updated radars and Gun Directors

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Author:  Thiel [ May 23rd, 2013, 10:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: USS Montana BB-67 2013 Modernization (under construction
You can't link from skydrive
Author:  heuhen [ May 23rd, 2013, 12:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: USS Montana BB-67 2013 Modernization (under construction
Be the cool boy and use this, but also read the text "clever boy" (in an Clint Eastwood accent!):

http://www.shipbucket.com/forums/viewto ... ?f=5&t=985



BTW. Admin I have an good idea: why not put up in the registration but also in the log in page, Tips for new beginners with links to a couple good IMG host.
Author:  DJBattlestations [ June 3rd, 2013, 9:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: USS Montana BB-67 2013 Modernization (under construction
Thanks! I told ya I needed help. That is a great suggestion heuhen. If I'd had that in the first place, I wouldn't have been so lost. I have now modified and corrected the original post and added the picture.
Author:  sabotage181 [ June 3rd, 2013, 11:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: USS Montana BB-67 2013 Modernization (under construction
I like this, a lot. Cool cool cool. I can't give any suggestions a to the drawing, as i am a newbie also, but i would put the 48 on the forward Mast, not only is it your primary radar, but this is the arrangement all NTU ships used. You want your primary radar to have the farther radar horizon, and i used to be a 48 tech so I believe it should have the prominent position ;)
Author:  acelanceloet [ June 3rd, 2013, 1:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: USS Montana BB-67 2013 Modernization (under construction
woa.
uhm........
unlike sabotage181, I really don't like this.

drawing wise, it is not bad, only:
- Mk 49 RAM front views are blurred
- 30 mm mounts are blurred
- some double black pixels in the helideck and VLS
- the double very dark grey lines under the overhangs with the harpoons and the VLS block distract from the rest, I would suggest using only a single line of that colour with maybe a lighter one below it, if this is also done in the rest of the ship (if I see it correct, it isn't)
- the credit line and the ships name on the template are blurred

design wise, I have a bit more to be troubled about
- the Mk 41 block. you have placed it on top of the engine rooms, making it a lot harder to service those. for an ship that is already in service for 50 years, maintenance becomes an pain in the ass, and you make it even more so.
- the weight of the VLS block will also have huge implications on the lower levels of the ship. we are speaking here about 6*118 tons to 7,5*118 tons, EMPTY, for the VLS system only. this means 708 - 885 tons. this adds half an turret in weight to your ship.... the construction around it most likely adds (most of) the other half, and then we haven't even loaded the missiles.
- this will not only massively impact the ships construction, but also the stability (the center of gravity goes up)
- that entire structure should be removed if the boiler rooms need large spare parts. or you should open your armoured belt?

- did the montana have an stern hangar in design? if not, I would not recommend to cut it out, or to add an elevator, for that matter. if she had, you might get away with it.
- I have doubts about the funnel being able to support the platform for the phalanx
- why the hell so many AGS turrets? if you look in the belowdeck parts thread you see those need way more space belowdecks then the original turrets.
- why have the AGS anyways? or better said, why bother with the main guns when you ship AGS, which has an larger rate of fire, more accuracy, more range, and is cheaper to operate? fitting AGS on board undermines the entire existence of this ship
- I think you forgot that the RAM launchers have deck penetration
- I think every single thing your have added is heavier then designed, thus your ship will lay deeper in the water, and thus be slower and also less stable.
- you are going to need to expand the ships generator systems by a factor 10 or 20, if you want to be able to operate all these weapons
- the foremast looks flimsy, and ends at the sides on a structure which I doubt could take the forces
- that platform you added to the funnel looks like it will break off
- missiles will hit the funnels and platforms even without wind bending their course a bit.
- your harpoons blow fire right into your ventilation system below the phalanx
- the 57mm's make no sense to me (well more then the AGS, that is) and I have doubts about you being able to fit them over there
- you are going to need more superstructure space to fit the computers, cabinets and cooling for all these systems.
- I have my doubts about modern guns (the 30mm for example) being able to witstand the main guns blast.

I won't bother with the radars because when you have even part of the above fixed, everything about that will be different :P
Author:  Shipright [ June 3rd, 2013, 3:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: USS Montana BB-67 2013 Modernization (under construction
I think two simple fixes that would address much of the issues with this ship is to remove the 2 and three turrets and put a groupling of VLS into that space and then moving the harpoons to where you have the VLS allowing you to lower the unsupported funnel CIWIS do where the harpoons currently are.

The turret deletion would remove a lot of wieght allowing you to add the VLS and all the added electronics components you are going to need to fit this thing out. Additionally those turrets already have reserved to them several decks worth of below deck space you can fit the VLS into and they will also be lower than where you currently have them helping with center of gravity.

AGS should just be deleated and then you can move back the 57mm closer amidships to get them further form the main gun blast effects (removing 3 and 4 turrents would help too), I would do the same with the 30mms too. You also need to add some small boat storage somwhere that is surrently occupied by AGS.
Author:  acelanceloet [ June 3rd, 2013, 3:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: USS Montana BB-67 2013 Modernization (under construction
Shipright wrote:
I think two simple fixes that would address much of the issues with this ship is to remove the 2 and three turrets and put a groupling of VLS into that space and then moving the harpoons to where you have the VLS allowing you to lower the unsupported funnel CIWIS do where the harpoons currently are.

The turret deletion would remove a lot of wieght allowing you to add the VLS and all the added electronics components you are going to need to fit this thing out. Additionally those turrets already have reserved to them several decks worth of below deck space you can fit the VLS into and they will also be lower than where you currently have them helping with center of gravity.
true, was it not that the rebuilding of the stem and stern (round gap and magazines of the turret swapped for an rectangular gap with VLS in it) would be comparable in cost with an new build vessel, both in design costs and building costs
also, the lower weight of the VLS compared with the turrets brings it's own set of problems.
Author:  Colosseum [ June 3rd, 2013, 3:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: USS Montana BB-67 2013 Modernization (under construction
Quite an interesting choice to keep Mk.51 and 57 directors in place. I imagine the lead-computing gunsights on those Mk.51s would be very useful for RAM guidance. ;)
Author:  Shipright [ June 3rd, 2013, 4:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: USS Montana BB-67 2013 Modernization (under construction
acelanceloet wrote:
Shipright wrote:
I think two simple fixes that would address much of the issues with this ship is to remove the 2 and three turrets and put a groupling of VLS into that space and then moving the harpoons to where you have the VLS allowing you to lower the unsupported funnel CIWIS do where the harpoons currently are.

The turret deletion would remove a lot of wieght allowing you to add the VLS and all the added electronics components you are going to need to fit this thing out. Additionally those turrets already have reserved to them several decks worth of below deck space you can fit the VLS into and they will also be lower than where you currently have them helping with center of gravity.
true, was it not that the rebuilding of the stem and stern (round gap and magazines of the turret swapped for an rectangular gap with VLS in it) would be comparable in cost with an new build vessel, both in design costs and building costs
also, the lower weight of the VLS compared with the turrets brings it's own set of problems.
Lets be honest, there is no economically viable way to add VLS that isn't "strap a new dedicated superstuction on," which has all sorts of engineering and survivablity issues. Depending on the size of the VLS batteries you could build them inside the turrets footprint but then I don't think the VLS armament would be big enough to justify the ship. You could easily get a Burke forward 32 cell arrangement in there.

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